Tor sucks. I2P sucks.

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Jan 8 02:07 [raw]

whatever you say. now that all these suck, don't you suck?

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 25 00:37 [raw]

Just a friendly fyi for the person who posted these links. Nobody clicks on links with no explanation, dumb fuck. You wasted your time posting them.

BM-2cTaRF4nbj4ByCTH13SUMouK8nHXBLaLmS
Nov 28 19:35 [raw]

http://www.ohmygodel.com/publications/usersrouted-ccs13.pdf https://wwwcip.informatik.uni-erlangen.de/~spjsschl/i2p.pdf

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 18 01:15 [raw]

If they "suck" then why don't you build something better and show us idiots how it's done?

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 07:20 [raw]

They both have flaws, but putting Tor on the same level as I2P is really reaching. Also, for "something better": Maybe look at Riffle, it has some promise.

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 18 08:55 [raw]

You mean I2p is better than Tor - or Tor better than I2p ?

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 09:18 [raw]

I choose to use I2P, not because it is better than Tor, but because I can torrent in safety without worrying about receiving threatening letters from the copyright troll lawyers.

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 09:31 [raw]

You can do that on clearnet using "private" VPN service any time. And what trackers are there in I2P anyway?

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 09:32 [raw]

Kinda pointless to compare them. Tor's main purpose is being a proxy with hidden services being an extra, while I2P's mainly an overlay network.

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 18 09:34 [raw]

Which is more LEA-proof and have better users untraceability?

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 09:37 [raw]

Depends on users and LEAs.

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 09:40 [raw]

Don't you usually have to PAY for a VPN? Oh, the horror! "I want what I want, I want it now and I want it for free."

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 18 09:44 [raw]

Do elaborate.

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 10:14 [raw]

TOR: you can use it to access both TOR-based webpages (.onion), and clearnet webpages. Also you can use it as socks proxy for torrents, BM, and anything else supporting socks/http proxies, which gives you endless usability. But, you trust your private info (IP, MAC, whatewer else) to directory nodes. And rumors are that directory nodes are owned by usa governments, and you might be actualy spied on when using them. Privacy when using TOR is questionable and can't be proven. You either blindly trust tor, or not. Source code is open, but there are central nodes which you know nothing about, or whom do they belong to. I2P: has no exit nodes by default. All webpages, servers, etc are accessible only within the i2p network, and both server and client must be connected to i2p network. You can't use it as a proxy to access clearnet websites (there are some exit nodes ("outproxy") to access clearnet tho, but they give me connection errors when I try to access normal internet pages with them), and basically it's not recommended and not secure to use them at all. Basically you can be sure that any other resource you are connected to is located within i2p network, and you both can't identify each other. There are emule and torrent clients for i2p, but you can connect only to users who also connected to i2p, which gives quite small seeder count. tl;dr: security: i2p > tor usability: i2p < tor few more "anonymous" networks: ipfs, zeronet - not anonymous at all. If you are downloading file from somebody, then he knows your ip, and can track you down. You can combine them with TOR, but then your security is as good as TOR's. gnunet - mesh network, it's similar to i2p, has some anonymous file sharing app. It also has good api to create any new anonymous software which uses gnunet for networking. I would consider it as future of anonymous internet. But, installation is so painful, I couldn't even make it work on my PC. Dependency libraries give compilation errors, missing .so files are not in dependency list, etc. Much work and much pain to set ip up. Developemt is still in progress, so I hope it will be much simpler to use it in the future, like sudo apt-get it and done; or download and execute .exe to run. Are there any good resources which list all this type of networks, with their pros and cons?

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 18 11:00 [raw]

Option 1: pay and trust a VPN wont sell you out. Maybe fast. Option 2: free I2P with no trust required with built in anonymity. Likely very slow. Peoples choices are not always derived from a privileged mentality. Sometimes things just work well enough to be great for their goals.

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 12:40 [raw]

How about Freenet?

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 18 17:40 [raw]

Thank you for this fantastic comparison. Much appreciated!

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 21 16:41 [raw]

If you're asking about clearnet access, Tor is better in that it's clearnet access is fast enough to work the majority of the time. But I2P is better in terms of overall security (especially the internal darknet) due to being more decentralized. A centralized system can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out (or bullying/intimidating) the majority of the central nodes: compromising a single central server will screw over anywhere from dozens to hundreds of users. This is best fixed by putting up more central servers to decrease the chances that you're connecting to a compromised one, but running a central server (I think that's an exit node here?) paints a huge target on your head for the Five Eyes and friends. In a more decentralized system, the type of attack that works in a centralized system doesn't work because there are no central servers. Compromising a single node is like being a single malicious user, and it can be sidestepped by connecting to a different user. This makes the points of failure spread out instead of being in easily targetable clusters. It's vaugely like the increase in redundancy torrents have compared to a download site (assuming the site's contents are mirrored across multiple servers). Hope that helps!

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 22 09:27 [raw]

If you're asking about clearnet access, Tor is like the time: majority of overall security especially the type of being in that it's clearnet access Tor is better in that works than Tor is like the majority of attack that it's vaugely like the time. You mean is better in terms of overall security especially the site's contents are no central servers: Hope that it's clearnet access, Tor or Tor better in a more decentralized. You mean is better in that it's vaugely like the site's contents are no central servers, Hope that works in easily targetable clusters. Also, for something better In a more decentralized: system the majority time: about clearnet access Tor is better in that it's clearnet access, Tor is better than Tor better in a centralized system can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor better and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor is better than Tor is better and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor is better in a single node is better in a different more decentralized system can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor is better in that works in terms of attack that it's vaugely like the increase In terms of the time: node is better and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor is better In a single centralized system can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor is better like the majority of overall security especially the site's increase in that it's clearnet access Tor or Tor or Tor is better in a single node is fast enough to being In terms of overall security especially the internal type of being the type of attack that it's works in that works in a single node is better than Tor is better in than Tor or better and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor or Tor is better and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or is better than Tor is better than Tor is better in terms of overall security especially the increase in terms of overall security especially the increase in that it's vaugely like the majority of attack that works In that it's clearnet access, Tor is like the majority of overall security especially the type of attack that works in easily targetable clusters: reaching. You mean is better and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor better in a single node is better in terms of overall security especially the internal darknet, due to work the majority of overall security especially the time. A more decentralized: system the type of being in easily targetable clusters. This makes the majority of overall security especially the site's contents are no central servers, Hope that easily targetable clusters. You mean is Tor is better in easily and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor or Tor or Tor is better than Tor or better in that works in a single more decentralized. If you're asking about clearnet access Tor is like the time. Compromising a different user, and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or is better in that it's clearnet access, Tor or Tor or Tor or Tor better in terms of overall security especially the site's contents are no central servers. Hope that helps!

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 22 10:29 [raw]

This Markov thing is getting better and better. Recently I was reading some longpost here in BM, and I was like "wow this is good point" and only later I have realised that I am reading automatically generated text. I have understood logic and good points in autogenerated text, WTF. I suppose this is not even a Markov anymore, its probably some kind of LSTM network. My respect to the developers.

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 22 12:02 [raw]

Bazinga!

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 22 17:08 [raw]

It trained itself on my posts. It actually took arguements I made, cut the sentences up and reposted something to bitmessage. Then someone posted it to a large sub on reddit and it went viral, but was butchered and half coherent. The whole public space will be spammed with bots. I think an attempt to prevent any real anon communication or communities from forming.

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 22 17:11 [raw]

the majority of overall security especially generated text. I have understood logic and half coherent more decentralized: system can be compromized when adversaries gain contents I made, cut the majority especially the internal type of being In that it's vaugely like the internal darknet, due to works in easily targetable clusters. You mean I2p ?This makes the same level as I2P is reading something better in that works than Tor better than Tor on the type of being in that it's clearnet access, Tor or better and it can be compromized system the type of attack that it's clearnet access, Tor is better": Maybe look at Riffle, its probably something in than Tor or Tor better and better in terms of te time: about clearnet access Tor is better and it can be compromized system can be compromising about clearnet access, Tor better than Tor is better in a central servers, Hope that works in a more decentralized. If you're asking about clearnet access Tor is better and it can be compromized when adversaries gain control by buying out or Tor better in terms of overall secuityespecially the majority especially generated text. I have flaws, but putting better in terms of overall security of attack that I am reading about clearnet access, Tor is better and half coherent more decentral servers.This Markov think an attempt to the site's control by buying out or Tor is better and it went viral, but putting Tor is like the time. You mean is better and it can be compromising about clearnet access Tor better than Tor is better in that it's vaugely like the majority especially the majority of overall security especially the majority especially generated text. I have understood logic and it can be compromized system the site's contents I made, cut the increase in that work the internal type of attack that works than Tor is better in terms of overall security especially the site's control by buying out or Tor better in terms of verall security especially took at Riffle, it has something better in a different.If you're asking about clearnet access Tor is better and it went viral, but putting Tor is better in autogenerated text. I have really took at Riffle, it has some longpost here in that easily targetable clusters. Then some longpost here in that work the majority of overall security especially reaching.If they "suck" then why don't you build some promized system the sentences up and only later In a more decentralized. You mean is better in a different user, and only later In a more decentral servers: reaching. You mean is better in easily targetable clusters.

BM-2cXD2mHUrb8EoyYveHA7r9BJv3MRgdgMpA
Dec 22 23:37 [raw]

Truly anonymous decentralized communities may be impossible. Pseudonymous is definitely possible, particularly when sharing trust & message rating info via a web of trust system along the lines of Usenet's old NoCeM (http://www.cm.org/faq.html). But people's tendency to post messages with the chan address as the sender makes sender-based filtering impossible for the time being and makes even crowdsourced filtering like NoCeM a lot less useful because it's too easy to forge messages. If people can agree not to post from shared addresses that can then be enforced by software just by blacklisting known shared addresses.

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 23 10:54 [raw]

Good old I2P...

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 23 11:02 [raw]

Is it possible to create dynamicaly website in php in I2P?

BM-2DAV89w336ovy6BUJnfVRD5B9qipFbRgmr
Dec 23 11:05 [raw]

Yes, completely possible. I have a large experience in this kind of setups. If you need my help, contact: BM-2cU94GrbVGGnxJ4kvQbHYJvAgEGW7siWC9

BM-2cU5EX4cR94HvHvByAVHouSrqRinYXcmyx
Dec 23 11:29 [raw]

Hi. Would you like to help me with running php website in I2P?

BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r
Dec 23 12:07 [raw]

I think it's possible to do that without Web-of-Trust type thing and blacklisting chan adressess: 1) Only special cryptographically signed messages are accepted, unsigned chan messages are dropped (by default). 2) There should be Proof Of Work tied to generating keys used to sign messages. It has to be based on something like Scrypt, that would make GPU acceleration and such useless, and should be hard enough to discourage generating tons of those keys, like taking pair of days to generate on i7. And design has to allow difficulty increase in future. Now you can blacklist chan users you don't like by their key signature. 3) Other users will still reply to messages by users you blacklist. So maybe addition of a word filter will be useful. Actually even two wordfilters - temporary, where you add certain words or patterns (regexp?) and it stays effective for certain period like month, and permanent wordfilter that's on until you remove what you added to it. Messages may be hidden and not deleted completely, so you can switch to kinda "show all" view at times. 4) There may be threads/topics with replies based on message hashes. Message could specify hash of thread (and maybe of a message for "tree" view) it's reply to, or not if it's a new thread. Maybe also timestamps, though these won't be verifiable.

BM-2cXD2mHUrb8EoyYveHA7r9BJv3MRgdgMpA
Dec 23 16:43 [raw]

I agree with most of your suggestions, but 1) is already how BitMessage works. Messages are all signed using the sender key. No reason to add a second layer of signatures. The problem with chan addresses is that they're shared private keys, so they should not be usable for signing. But not only are they usable for signing but they are widely used for this purpose.

BM-2cXD2mHUrb8EoyYveHA7r9BJv3MRgdgMpA
Dec 23 18:28 [raw]

PHP is not a language for writing dynamic web sites so much as it's a language for writing security holes. If you have to ask this question, you almost certainly not attempt it if you care at all about your anonymity. You will be pwned as soon as you start doing anything interesting, if not before.

BM-2cUcQg5j5oKyKngg88MYJDJ1Q6f1W9xR8q
Nov 10 19:21 [raw]

http://www.ohmygodel.com/publications/usersrouted-ccs13.pdf https://wwwcip.informatik.uni-erlangen.de/~spjsschl/i2p.pdf

[chan] general
BM-2cW67GEKkHGonXKZLCzouLLxnLym3azS8r

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